Episode 2

Who Do You Listen To?

"I don't have time or space to entertain voices that haven't fought the same or harder fights that I'm fighting every day. I am looking for above average voices. I am looking for extraordinary voices." 

Meet the entire Unfuck My Business team. Learn a bit about how each of us got involved with this unusual and extraordinary project.

In this episode: Chris Delaney, Chris 'Jinx' Jenkins, Danielle Laura, Kathleen Seide, Victor Bolivar, Jenn Bolivar, Robyn Sayles

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EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:

Chris Delaney: In five and four and three and two and one.

Jenn Bolivar: Holy fuck. This is amazing. This is a minefield of intelligence genius. These people are fantastic, and I'm inspired, and I have to keep coming back.

Chris 'Jinx' Jenkins: Welcome to the most valuable fucking show you're going to listen to all week.

Chris Delaney: This. Is. Unfuck My Business.

Welcome back to the Unfuck my business show. This is your host, Chris Delaney. And today I'm excited to share with you a little bit about a principle that I like to call: who do you listen to? And when I think about who I listen to, I think about this principle and they call it the law of association.

Some of y'all might've heard, if you hang out with four readers, you're going, gonna be the fifth reader. Four rich people, you're gonna be the fifth rich person. I hope. Sometimes if you hang out the wrong people, it can be just as bad. I'm from New York, and if you hang out with, four Eagles you'll soar, but if you hang out with four pigeons, you're going to spend your spare time shitting on cars from rooftops.

I don't want to be shitting on cars in my spare time. I want to hang out with great people and hang out with doers. I want to hang out with people who are looking at big ideas with me and want to make that shit happen. So today I'm introduce you to my A team, people I talked about our very first episode, the people that I called up with a crazy ask, and I said, Hey, listen, I have no idea where this is going to go.

But I need your time. I need your talent and we're going to do something with this, and I don't know what yet, but you're going to help me with this. If that's cool with you, and you got nothing else better to do you on a Tuesday night or a Sunday night anyways, because listen its COVID. Where are we going?

So I'm going to introduce you to some of these people who I listened to, the people who've been where I've been and are where I desire to be and the people that are in my inner circle, because. When you're listening to people, you want to make sure that they're able to provide insight. They don't change your ideas.

They're asking great questions. They are the people who ask the considerations you haven't thought of. So today I will introduce you to step-by-step who I called first, second, third. Not that they were my first choice. Second choice. I don't want them to know that. Be careful with that, but we're going to go for it.

Guys. Listen, the first person I called when it came to putting together as crazy idea of how we can help people unfuck their businesses. With our collective resilient entrepreneurs. It was a guy you may have heard of the grumpy old bastard of tech Jinx himself. What's going on? My brother. How are you?

Chris 'Jinx' Jenkins: Hey man, it's another Sunday morning.

Chris Delaney: I know we talked a little bit about how you and I got started and the conversation where we got a little drunk on some of Moses. And we decided to put this little zoom call together from around the world. But what was COVID like for you when things first started ripping and happening, you had your own stuff going on and what kind of considerations came up for you?

When I was like, Hey, man, don't know what's going to happen, but let’s go for it. What's going through your mind?

Chris 'Jinx' Jenkins: The biggest things in a lot of ways, I'm lucky because we've built our team at our company, from the ground up to be cloud friendly and remote workable. Being able to be mobile has always been a priority for us.

And that's worked well for dealing with hurricanes in the past and things along that line. So yeah. COVID just became another sort of disaster response type situation. And we were well-prepared for it. So, in the course of a weekend, essentially, we took our company a hundred percent remote with 22 employees and life didn't change much from that perspective. We're spending a lot more time at home, but aside from that, the business carried on as usual. But what I was seeing all around me was people getting laid off businesses, closing their doors. And seeing businesses that in particular didn't have the resiliency required to shift in the face of such a major social upheaval that, I was already in the mindset of what can I do to help.

So when that first conversation came about, that's the thing that I keyed in on is, Hey, we've got people in our community who are hurting, how can we do something right now that might help them for me, that was big.

Chris Delaney: So, there was no idea what we're going to do and how we're going to make it happen.

And so, the question for you, Jinx is, who do you listen to? How do you filter that through? Because man, you've been around the space for what 120 years or so. So how do you deal with that as the grumpy old bastard, as cynical as you are and everything that you've seen.

Chris 'Jinx' Jenkins: One of the things that I think it's easy to do, we do, especially in our contentious social environment right now is create our own little echo chambers of opinion that helps support our preconceived worldviews.

And so, one of the things that I'm a monster about is trying to get to verifiable underlying facts. And that's not always perfect, but when I sent her that as a core thing, it means that I don't need your share some opinion that supports my own. When I do see these things, especially when they're inflammatory, I tend to try and go look for neutral sources of data on that.

So, it's not so much that I listened to any individual. Per se, but I'm a huge fan of things like pub med and some of the generic newsfeeds like Reuters and AP that are just providing data and letting you sort through that. But it comes to who I listen to. Hard data is my biggest filter.

Chris Delaney: So hard data is King. And I know that we talked about this as well, because when COVID is first reared its ugly head, and we didn't really know what to expect. The online space, Facebook, everybody became a medical doctor overnight and it was Bill Gates and his 5g trying to fry everybody's brain through their tinfoil, hats, and shit like that.

But. It was really interesting to see that response. And so, I remember I asked you, how do we begin to find really actionable, clear data that can help these businesses and the people around them. And what would that look like? What would we have to do? And you and I had some thoughts and ideas about a think tank. And I said, a mastermind and it was like, Nope, not doing that. You know what I mean?

Chris 'Jinx' Jenkins: Taking out the commercial aspect of it is important. If there's a sales pitch, then it's there's less of a, an objectivity to it. And I definitely, I've always wanted to be involved with something that was a little bit more about the meat of the offer versus the pitch of it.

Chris Delaney: Yeah. And so when you're, we've had a lot of discussions at this point, by the time this episode airs we'll have been doing this for about 30 or so weeks or more, most of the year, we've been dedicated every single Tuesday night. And then Sundays, we have strategic meetings, and this is voluntary, we're coming together with expertise and obviously you positioned in the technology space and the data and the digital space. How do you feel like, you’ve been providing like real insights? Individuals have been coming to the table asking about their businesses.

Chris 'Jinx' Jenkins: A lot of times when people are asking about their businesses, they're asking emotional questions and that's where it comes back down to the data. People are so married to their brand or their brand message or their belief in a concept, which is itself an emotional position. And so, I try to help frame that and provide some outer edges. when you build a puzzle, the easiest way to do it is to find the corners and start working your way in.

And so, I like to use the math and some underlying, just basic statistical questions. To really start framing that in let's really see what this looks like. And I think deconstructing it down to those core basic principles is always a good place to start when you're looking at business problems, because while it feels like I'm going to lose my house, I'm going to lose my family. I'm not gonna be able to pay for groceries. The real question is. My revenue was way down, how can I make that better? And so, we have to divorce the emotional side of that from the hard data side.

Chris Delaney: I love it. You can all see why I chose Jinx is somebody I had to have in the corner when we launched this thing.

So, I'm gonna move over to the next person that by proximity itself was leveraged into this crazy journey and she's followed me into many, and I followed her into hers as well. And I respect everything about her and the way she does business.  Danielle Laura. how are ya?

Danielle Laura: Hey Chris. I'm awesome. Thank you for having me.

Chris Delaney: This is great. So, you got to see the ideation of this happen from a real time point of view, because it was about 30 days before things took me to Jinx and having that conversation. And you saw the back end planning of this thing, but what got you excited to be a part of hopping on these zoom calls and taking your Tuesday nights and your Sundays and all this time for an idea?

Danielle Laura:  Realistically, it was a very inopportune time because we were launching, you myself and our other business partner, we're launching two other businesses that we had been working on for about a year at that point. So we were extremely busy and had a lot on our plates, but what was so appealing about this concept of core, which we didn't have a name for at that point was helping businesses pivot in the time of crisis, which at that point was COVID.

And I think any time we're able to come in for me anyway, anytime I can be a part of something groundbreaking that I know in my soul is going to positively impact humanity in some way. I want to be a part of it. So, it was pretty easy for me to accept that and to say yes, despite all of the other things that were going on, because I really could feel into the vision of bringing together this collective group of experienced competent individuals who could really collectively help whomever was going to be able to come in and need business, help and pivoting in that period of time. So that was very worth it to me.

Chris Delaney: How did you make the decision? So, we had the development of a website we've been working on and at a company we hadn't development for almost a year. We had partner, we were on calls day after day, getting this website set up our partner up in Canada, Erin Foggoa, shout out dope socks and creative. Incredible individual. And we had spent all this time, right? We were in full cost of commitment mode. We were invested financially, emotionally, spiritually, probably. So how did you make that decision that you were like, Hey, let's make the pivot for ourselves and begin to start focusing on serving without any expectation of what's gonna happen?

Danielle Laura: So anytime I make decisions, I put it through the filter of, is this an alignment with a core value or belief that I have and a core value and belief that I have is I always want to help people in the best way possible. So, knowing that was something that was in alignment with what core was going to become, it was a pretty easy decision for me.

Chris Delaney: So, for you as a business owner and for somebody who's been around at all, you've seen all the business stuff out there in the online space, all the gurus, all the nonsense. What do you think makes core so different from the idea to how we've been doing what we've been doing for the last 30 or so weeks?

Danielle Laura: A lot of stuff out there that I've seen and have even been a part of is a lot of fluff. It's a lot of really strong marketing. And a lot of selling on a lot of fluff versus what our group is really was this place to be raw, real, and let's get shit done, not just talk about stuff, but let's actually implement and bring these changes to life.

And I think there's not enough implementation out there from what I've seen. There's a lot of talk. Not a lot of doing so this is a group of doers and I think that's what sets it apart. Also coming to a place where you may have strangers in this group, you may never have met these people before, but being able to be a judgment free zone, where it's safe, where you guys can freely talk about, what's not working in your business and be open enough to receive really pointed feedback that can truly help you.

That's pretty incredible. And it's pretty rare. I don't see that a lot.

Chris Delaney: I love it. And so, for you, how do you make decisions on who you listen to? What filters do you run it through and how do you decide where to spend your time, money, and attention?

Danielle Laura: I ask myself, does this person or business, whatever it is that I'm doing. Does this person have what I want, are they where I eventually want to be? And do they understand my business or my relationship, my, whatever it is in life. And if those things are yes, great. I'm probably going no, listen to them. If it's a no, I let their opinion go. Everybody has opinions and they want to be valued. But if this person does not have what ultimately what you want and know how to help you get it, let it go.

Chris Delaney: I agree, 100%. What would you say is the most difficult thing you've had to face as we've been navigating the space this year, aside from obviously the undefined then giving away from some of the momentum we've had in other areas, would you say is the biggest challenge that you've had to face or the problem you've had to solve this year?

Danielle Laura: Resiliency around the pivoting. In business, in my own personal business, with my private client work are several businesses. There've been a lot of pivots this year. Because things were getting shut down or certain things, everything kept having, it seemed like a halt at some point.

And so, when that happens, it's like we put in so much energy and effort and resources now what, you have to pivot. So, I would say the theme of 2020 that I've learned is to pivot with grace and understand nothing is really guaranteed. So how can we pivot with grace and the quickest way possible to still be able to produce an outcome? That's going to be beneficial for everyone involved.

Chris Delaney: So, would you say that COVID really because there's an entrepreneur's way to do shit on our own, right? We like to be those visionaries. We all are very strong on our own. And so sometimes the integration of other people on to a team, for instance, like I wasn't that guy who liked doing group projects in school, I hated it.

You're probably not going to do as good as I am really because this, let me do it right. Just put your name on it. We'll handle it. Cause we don't want all that confusion. was it difficult for you to come to the table with really strong people like this and to find a place within, for us to operate really well together? Or do you find that there's a little bit of a challenge or was it really easy for you?

Danielle Laura: I wouldn't say it was difficult at all with this group, because everybody in here are exceptional leaders and doers. So that was really refreshing. That was insanely refreshing for me because I'm used to being the one that has to lead everybody and dragging them along.

I was the kid that hated group projects because I would do everything. It's the same as what you said. So, it was really easy and super refreshing that everybody was coming into this group with such a level of expertise and ownership in their own spaces that made it a really collaborative, easy process.

Chris Delaney: Love that feedback. I'm going to jump from you to another individual. This is where it gets fun, because just talk to two people that know me extremely well. We're going to go out to some people that I literally messaged. So I messaged probably close to about 60 or so people that I intentionally focused on with the social media following, and then also people my phone book, I said, who would I love to partner with in some way, shape or form again, with the ask of, I don't know what this looks like, but if you're open, would you like to be a part of this? Because I think we can do some really epic shit together help some businesses. And I think that you have an expertise that I think could be really useful in this, where you lead from who you are. And all that good stuff.

So, Kathleen Seide was somebody that I'd met at our entrepreneurial social club here in St. Pete. Danielle and I had met her when we first moved down here and she's become a very good friend of ours and obviously from the real estate space and everything else, she helped us find our home here at Tampa, but there's some key principles and things about you as an individual that I really deeply respected. Not to mention, she fucking dives into caves and the dark miles down into the ocean. How bad ass is that? So, no stranger from the difficult, but I want to ask you a question. What was it like when you got this message from me? And I was just like, Hey, don't know, something had happened. We're going to do something here. We're going to go. We're going to launch here's when the call is, what was that like for you, Kathleen?

Kathleen Seide: So, it starts out, you give me a call and you're like, Hey, there's this thing I want to do. I'm getting a bunch of people together. And then you start listing off some of the people. And these are some of my very favorite people that I've met in the last year and a half here in St. Pete. And I'm like, fuck yeah! Do I want to spend an hour or two on the phone with these people? Yes. I love every opportunity I have to hang out with these people because they operate from a place of abundance. They cheer each other's successes. They share amazing information freely. Yes. I want to be in that room please and thank you. That was my response inside when you called me.

Chris Delaney: Were you in a space where you were seeing things happening real time and so you're open or would you say you had to make some shifts and some pivots yourself?

Kathleen Seide: As far as my work schedule and stuff goes, COVID had come in and we were locking down, work was slower. We've always been really financially conservative, so there wasn't a pressure there. And I was looking at ways of supporting people around me and supporting my community. So, I was looking at the ways in which people needed to be supported the emotional journeys that they were going on, the confusion, the panic in places, lack of understanding around how a virus works. And so, I was doing what I could to reach out and support people. I have a lot of tools around remaining calm and centered and mindful. And I was trying to share that with people. So, I was actively trying to reach out and do the things that I could do to contribute, to supporting my community already. And then you came in with this business aspect of being able to support and contribute to what other businesses in our community were doing, which was amazing.

Chris Delaney: What would you say was the experience like for you? So I know one of the things that we really jived down in the very beginning when social media was a thing, it was like, people just gravitate because they had so much free time and they're trying to download all this information on Facebook and everything else.

We challenged each other back and forth to be present and to be present with communities and to share ways to connect because people were in emotional chaos. And we started with that. what was that all about? What was that like?

Kathleen Seide: I was shocked at the response that I got. I really didn't expect people to resonate with the message that I was putting out there in the way that they did. I didn't realize the magnitude of the voice that I had in the community I've built around me and the people that want to be around me and are listening to what I have to say. I would put a post out just about certain techniques you could use to get to bed more easily, because, with the high levels of stress, people having trouble sleeping.

And so, I went through and just did a little Facebook live about that. And I got. All these messages from people saying, thank you. And this is amazing and keep doing it. And it's great to see you. And I wasn't prepared for that response. It was really beautiful.

Chris Delaney: When you say you weren't prepared, walk me through that. What was that like?

Kathleen Seide: I'm used to interacting in a deep level. One-on-one with people. Yeah. I connect, we get into deep conversations, dig through some meaty stuff, but I tend to do it one-on-one I don't do it from behind a camera. I don't do it on stage. And so, there wasn't really an expectation that there would be an audience. At all.

And I'm just putting something out there and I figured there'd be five people that pop on my life and I'd be like, okay, cool. I'd say hi to them and I'd talk. And then I'd go about my day. And I wasn't prepared for it to have more of a life than that. And it really did. And it was really profound to see how much impact it had on people's lives and being able to spread that to them and help them in those ways. It's really cool.

Chris Delaney: I love it. And you're no stranger to the journey of life and the things that you've gone through. I'm excited that down the road we'll probably be doing well, I know we'll definitely be doing an interview together, going more in depth. And I really respected the fact that you blended and you're very open about that journey as I am as well.

And I resonate that with so much about people who are, who they are, no matter what's in front of them, no matter who's asking the questions, no matter what format it's in, you're very much are who you are. So, it's easy to know what to expect and where you lead from, which is so open, which is awesome. And I'm going to ask you that question to you. How do you choose who you listen to? What do you look for?

Kathleen Seide: I like to be around people who operate from a place of abundance. Who celebrate the people around them succeeding? I love it when I'm the least smart person in the room. I want to be around people who are experts in whatever it is that they're really passionate about and love sharing it. And one of my favorite things, anybody that I meet, in general, so outside of picking a person to pay attention to, I meet a lot of people in my work, whatever. I meet a lot of people and I’m not going to let a meeting go without having a value to it. So, I have very focused questions that tend to open people up about what they're passionate about and what can I learn from them? What do they have that's unique to them that they can share with me? So I start with that and every person I meet and the people that I really pay attention to and listen to are people who have that positive energy about them, but also have this level of expertise that I'm constantly learning from them.

I am passionate about learning. I'm a very curious person, I tend to have an eclectic collection of information in my head because I just soak up information as much as I can from the people around me.

Chris Delaney: My last question is what's your favorite question to ask, to get to the core of somebody, about what they're passionate about?

Kathleen Seide: I'll come to them and ask them what they do. And they start telling me about work and I'm like, no, no, no. Not work. What do you do? What really excites you? And they're shocked, like nobody ever asks this question to people apparently, and they will pause for a minute and stare at me and be like, you really want to know that? Yes! That's the only thing I want to know, tell me about it. And that opens them up and creates this really interesting conversation.

Chris Delaney: So especially in what you do with real estate, I know that was my last question, but I'm always breaking this rule and because you're in real estate, there's always that aspect of, I remember meeting people, I'm like, Oh, I'm a real estate agent. I'm like, great. I know a million real estate agents. I don't want to know what you do for a living. I want to know what you live to do. So, when it comes to that industry that you're involved in and you've been doing it for quite a long time, how would you say you've differentiated yourself? And create this incredible experience that we were a part of as well, cause we just bought a house obviously, but how have you created that as a business owner in a space that's so congested and people just are who they are to a degree?

Kathleen Seide: For me, we operate from a place of your home, supports your lifestyle. And when you start from that perspective, you realize you have to really dive into who a person is and what they value before you can start looking at details of the what's in the where's of a particular property and what's right for them. So, until you know what is going to blow their socks off and really get them excited about living somewhere, how can you tell them whether a house is right for them or not? So, it's all about really customizing that experience and diving deep into that, who they are, what they value what's important to them and their family. Before you even start talking about a house.

Chris Delaney: As a byproduct of that experience spot on spot on as a friend of mine used to say. Love that. So now I get to go to a very unique position, which is I get to talk to a couple, one of which I had met of this couple at ESC as well. And I heard him talking about Churroland Sweets and we were sitting next to each other and having a discussion about marketing and some other conversations.

And then, I got to meet his beautiful wife, and we were able to sit down, break bread together and have a discussion, but we hadn't really spent that much time together. So, it's going to be a fun one. So, I'm going to bring Jen and Victor to the table and ask the question. I know I reached out to you Victor.

And I said, Hey man, this is crazy, but I also know you're crazy too. And I sent you that message. So, what was; do you remember what that message said? I can't look back at my text, but I remember what it was. And what you initially thought about what I sent it was sent over to you?

Victor Bolivar: So, like you just said, I probably met you in person twice in my life. I went to the entrepreneur social club and you were there sitting next to me and we were talking just clicked like a bromance type of thing. Love at first sight type of situation.

Chris Delaney: I got called an asshole at that meeting too, by the way,

Victor Bolivar: I remember that. Yes. And I knew, I thought you knew the person, that's another story, but you ended up not knowing who he was. He was crazy. And then we went out for dinner about a week later. You and Danielle, me, and my beautiful wife. And we talked about a lot of shit. We talked for about two hours, maybe two and a half hours about all sorts of stuff from businesses to spirituality and all sorts of stuff that we went through. And then we went our separate ways and then that's when COVID hit and that's when everything started to happen. I believe you actually call me; I got a phone call from the you, saying, listen, I'm trying to put some people together in this zoom call. I've not done it a zoom call ever in my life, and you said, we've done it. We're going to try to help our businesses. So, I liked that part for the ones that know me. They know that I enjoy talking about business. That's what I really am passionate about improving processes. How can I help you? That has been me throughout my life.

That's what I've liked doing and what I've actually done. So, I liked the part of you telling me that we're going to help businesses. So, I pitched it to my wife now to Jennifer. I said baby, here’s this guy's calling me. Remember Chris, the crazy tall guy, he's calling me up. We're going to jump in this call, helping business say I have no idea what we're going to do. I was very oblivious of everything that was turning out to be. So, we decided just to join you and give it a try. I was in the midst of obviously COVID had just hit, I have a food truck for the ones that don't know. And, my business relies on events, outdoors events, and all those events were canceled.

Like one day after the other. I'll keep getting emails, these things canceled is that things cancel. So, I wasn't really fearful about my economics in my household. I have a job. My wife has a job as well, but my business was certainly crumbling and just crashing down. So that's how it went. I went in with a growth mindset to see what this is going to take us. And we'll jump on a call and, I'll let Jennifer explain how I pitched it to her.

Chris Delaney: I would love to hear this. How did that go, Jennifer?

Jenn Bolivar: It was an easy sell; I will say that. Obviously, everyone hears his beautiful accent. And how can you say no to anything he asks? Anytime I'm asked to jump into something? Absolutely, yes. No, but in all honesty, as Victor alluded to, my day job allows me to explore the people, helping people movement. And it's something that's greater than the fact that I work at a financial institution.

And one of the things that I immediately aligned with was helping businesses. And I was like, I have to be a part of this. On the first call, I'm hearing the repertoires and the wonderful things that all of these individuals are bringing to the table. I'm like, Holy fuck. This is amazing. This is a minefield of intelligence, genius. These people are fantastic, and I'm inspired, and I have to keep coming back.

Chris Delaney: Love it. So, there's a lot of complexity going on in the household though. You guys have kids, you have the best damn empanada and churro truck in town. But it doesn't have business coming to it. And then, there's this whole entire thing. And why I love this too, is that you both come from that financial background, working with small and large banks and being able to dissect the information. Jinx has been talking about from the economic point of view in terms of how economics works, which always makes my eyes glaze over, but I'm glad to have it in my corner because I can defer to him and say, does this make sense?

But also, for y'all, business owners, we're looking at PPP loans, EIDM money, there's all kinds of stuff going on. And you guys just kept showing up, but how do you balance that with kids and everything else going on as well?

Jenn Bolivar: I would say commitment and priority. My priority at that moment in time was as an executive at a financial institution. I'm also a giver and I firmly felt that it was in my best interests and it was my responsibility to show up as a giver and a person that says, what do you need? What's going on for you? So, I really never focused on myself. I think that we've done an excellent job of having self-reliant kids and just being there for them in the way that they needed to just as I would for anyone else. Having another opportunity to give it was very easy to prioritize, coming to and showing up week after week to core.

Victor Bolivar: Yeah. So, I second that as well, obviously for the first part of COVID hitting us and me feeling it personally with my business crumbling down, and I'm part of this community of food truckers. And I hear all day long I'm hearing these guys, everybody struggling. What I loved about coming into core is that I was able to switch from, Oh my God, this is happening, how am I going to fix me? How am I going to fix my business and get better at it? And then I could switch it to listen, I'm sure everybody's going through what I'm going through. How can we collaborate together and help each other and fix each other's app? And obviously I've been in several businesses, I'm a serial entrepreneur and I've done many things. So, I found it in the first few calls that I could bring some value to those businesses.

So that really turned me on to continue to show up every Tuesday and spend numerous hours. We go on for three, four hours on Tuesdays and I just enjoy it. And that's what I liked. I was able to switch my mindset from oh fuck, what am I going to do about my business? How am I going to pivot? And just switch it to listen. How can I be of value to other people, to other businesses? How can we collaborate? How can I ask for help? Maybe you have different ways that you think you can help me so that collaboration and that change of mindset going from, how can I get better? How can I get out of this to go to, how can I help other people, how can I add value to other businesses?

Chris Delaney: I love that. And that transition from feeling sorry for yourself to realizing that you can help others, I think is where the difference between the immaturity and the maturity in business goes for me and my opinion. It's you're in the space of Oh shit, there's a lot going on. But also, to have the wherewithal, to put yourself aside for a second and say listen, shit's going down.

I can help a lot of people with what I know that I forgot yesterday. And that's what I love the expertise that you both lead from. So, my question for you is, and for both of you is. How do you know who you listened to? How do you choose with all this stuff out there, all the books, the people, the voices, how do you choose?

So, I love the kind of the call-out that Jinx made to Jenn Bolivar:  not having an echo chamber, definitely getting a whole plethora of objective ideas and opinions. But I think one of the key things that I look at is consistency in terms of, this is what I say, this is who I represent myself to be, this is my value as a business .And, are the actions there that support all of what you're stating?

Coming from a financial institution, we are data rich and being in the not-for-profit space we share, and there's more than 3,500 credit unions across the United States. So, we're not at a deficit of information and information that is true and very specific to a lot of communities that we get to pull from. But what I look at is are you leading in your actions as a business from the same place that you communicate? And that consistency really gives me that confidence of authenticity.

Victor Bolivar: Yes. I second that as well. Authenticity to me is huge. I like people to challenge my train of thought. I've done certain things and I do it my way. I've done it. I've done things the way I do them because that's me. But I like to hear people's opinions. And when they challenge my opinions and on a very articulate, smart way, so definitely authenticity. And what Jennifer says about being congruent of what you're saying and how, what your life look. Don't come to me and give me a business advise if you've never had a business or perhaps I've never done the things that I, where I want to be, so you can tell me, but I'm not really going to listen to you. I listened to other people that are where I want to be, or perhaps are taking the same path and I love diversity and different mindsets, the challenge, my own mindsets, my own thoughts. So that's huge for me as well.

Chris Delaney: So, we're going to have a lot of fun. I think. in future episodes, we get a chance to dive into some of this stuff for those listening. If you haven't heard Victor's accent, it's absolutely true. What Jennifer says. You can do anything. If you listen to Victor's voice in the morning, that's truly what keeps me going. But anyways, it is time to bring Jinx back to the table because we get to describe a little bit about how it's important to know that when you do have a vision, I believe in this concept, when you have that person in mind, who you're looking for, you don't have to absolutely know that person.

It's all about the relationships and the willingness, because when you're congruent, as Victor said, my belief is that people we'll bring other people and resources to the table. One of the cool additions that is just incredible from a space of somebody who has a killer taste in music, wildly creative, really outspoken, and just somebody I absolutely just love to talk to and spend, I don't know, four to five hours on a zoom call on a Tuesday night. Just shoot the shit aside for business. Has been the addition of Robyn Sayles to our leadership team. And what's cool about this is that Jinx actually invited her to one of our calls and this will give some insights. I'm gonna let Jinx, I'll let you take it away and talk a little bit about how Robyn came to the table. And then Robyn will, we'll have a little discussion about that too, but. How did everything come to be Jinx?

Chris 'Jinx' Jenkins: Oh, let's, we were talking about trying to expand a little beyond the initial group that we've put together in core. And I think you had specifically said, Hey, go out and look in your friends group this week and see if there are other people that you think might be a part of this. And I engage with a lot of people in the business networking space, but I don't think very many of them are people that I consider similar to me in some ways.

And this really applies like across a lot of fronts with Robyn. She's someone who has a clear visual brand. She and I both have that in common. We are instantly recognizable in our space and have had multiple, cartoon illustration type caricatures made with our branding. We're, visually unique people who are identifiable on that front. So, I've always respected that about her from a brand perspective, but she's also, an open-ended creative entrepreneur with like hard skills to bring to the table. And I think that, so many of the folks in the networking space that I've met, really aren't that. There's a lot of folks who are into, high-level info marketing or consulting coaching, but don't necessarily have certain kinds of technical skills to actually create things, to do some of the foundational physical work and Robyn is one of those people. She is someone who can write and create content and create courses and systems and has some of the technical skills necessary to really do, and in a mission of trying to make sure that I was looking for doers who could bring more skills to the table, she was just an obvious standout to me.

I reached out and I'm like, Hey, here's what we're doing. I'm gonna add you to the group. Is that cool? She's yeah. And then after our very first meeting, she's wow, y'all are actual action takers. And I'm like, yeah. And she's that's perfect because that's what I've been looking for.

Robyn Sayles: I believe my exact message to Chris was Holy shit. Thank you so much for inviting me to this call. These people are actually doing things I needed this so much.

Chris Delaney: What was that like for you, Robyn, you and I had never met before, so I didn't get the chance to send you that like really vague message, like mission impossible. Like this will self-destruct in 10 seconds. So, you came into the call and, you came into our realm and what was that like for you? What was different about it?

Robyn Sayles: It felt a little like a whirlwind, which is a word that gets a bad rap nowadays. So, I want to clarify, I don't mean that in a negative way, sometimes you get sucked into a really good whirlwind. And just from the moment of getting the invitation to I don't really know what this is about or what's going on, but I trust Jinx, everything else he's invited me to so far has been A+. So, let me see what's going on. And right away that first Tuesday call you're like, okay, so how can we help you? What do you need in your business? And I was a little Oh, okay. Like the new kid at the first day of school, I'm like, oh I'm not really prepared to answer that question, sir. But I will come back to you.

But just being asked that question made me know Oh, okay. These are my people. And within an hour of the questions being asked and the solutions being offered, and I don't remember specifically what it was, but like you fixed somebody's shit on the very first call that I was on and I was like, Yes, these are my people! Because, while I love to talk theory and philosophy, I also need to execute. I think that's the thing that holds most people back is that they don't take the action. And the reason I've left so many other groups, is okay, we're still talking in the same circles and nobody's actually doing anything and nobody's moving forward. So, let me go try the next one and see if any of those folks are actually trying to move things forward. Like we all know it's a weird time. We've all either got a part of our business or know a related business that everything came to a screeching halt as a result of COVID. Great. I don't need to talk about that anymore.

What I need to talk about is how do we help? What do we do different? I'm in an industry as a speaker where it was not only my source of income. It was also my main source of marketing. And both of those rugs got pulled. So, part of it was I need help, but I don't think I realized how much help I could get or really needed. But I was more coming at it from, the things that I have done up to this point don't work anymore. I don't know how to help people right now. So, let me go to a place where they seem to know how to help people and maybe I'll get the market research to figure it out. What can I put out now what I can do now? And instead of just getting research to figure out, oh, this is the kind of content I can put out. I've been able to actually help people like immediately, tangibly. And that's remarkable at this moment.

Chris Delaney: What was mind blowing to me too, was that it wasn't two weeks in. I think that we had our initial talks about putting a podcast together and we had met on a Sunday. We talked about it and within, I think it was like two weeks. You and Jennifer had gotten together and discussed like, how to put this thing together and you gave probably one of the most impressive presentations I've ever seen. As somebody who loves to work with teams and talk to businesses about like having great people around you, I was just mind blown.

I was like, there's considerations of how long this should take. There's considerations of what obstacles we could have. There's considerations of long-term planning. And oh, by the way, you have a team of eight people that are ready to put this thing together. And then Jennifer brings Faith to the table, which is, our producer who's kick ass, by the way. And I will get her on this show. And it was amazing. And so, within that, it was like a good indicator of like shit gets done. And then it was like rapid fire. We have our content planning meetings, we have our talk about implementation, and then we put our first it's four episodes in the can and we're still going.

So, it was really cool to see, especially for you in that branding space and that messaging space. For you to come to the table and give all this to the group, which in my opinion, Kathleen was talking about abundance before and I'm of the philosophy, like knowledge is free. There should never be a problem with giving as much as you can because that means you have more to give. And there's never like a point of oh, I shouldn't give too much hashtag value by my course. And that was really cool. So how did you make that decision for you? Was that just like an innate easy thing where it was like, I can provide this immediate insight and value, or was it like a, I feel like this could be a little bit of a risk or how'd you evaluate that time for yourself?

You have kids too, right? Kids, business, all bathroom renovations, all kinds of stuff going on.

Robyn Sayles: So many bathroom renovations. Yeah. There's a lot going on and I'm still trying to figure out how to keep this business afloat. And I've got one son who's entering college online, and I've got another son who is entering middle school online, and guess what? Nobody leaves the house anymore. And yet I keep getting involved in more things. And I don't know if we've properly qualified, like how fast this machine moves? Like within two to three weeks. And I hadn't even had a chance to talk to my best friend and she's what are you doing? And I'm like, I don't entirely know... I have an equity stake in something, and apparently, we're doing a podcast and I just keep saying yes to everything because it's fun and people are actually doing stuff.

And so, I think the short answer to your question is that's just how I'm built. The thing that you used to get me in trouble in the corporate world and in the corporate sales world, where you are taught to keep everything close to your chest and hide all your secrets and don't give any of that stuff away. That always bothered me. And I treat everybody like they're my best friend, even if I met you five minutes ago, because that's what I just love to do. And I like to be around people who are moving and grooving and getting things done and making things happen. And I like to collaborate, and I like to be, if you'll excuse the terrible and timely pun, I like to be in the room where shit happens. And so here in the midst of all the, I don't know how to move myself forward quite yet, I do know how to move these people forward. You want to start a podcast? I can fucking start a podcast. I've been in the podcast space, helping people since 2016. Like I got everything. And I'll lay it all out and I will point the direction you guys got to be ready to run. And it was really exciting for me to be around people who were like, cool, let's run, let's go.

Chris Delaney: And so, for you, how do you choose who you listen to? You're in that space of gurus and people who are saying things from stages and all that good shit. So how do you choose where you get the most hashtag value from?

Robyn Sayles: I'm going to ruffle some feathers with my answer, and I'm no longer afraid to ruffle some feathers with my answer. Because of some of the people that I've worked with, I have had a chance to see the man behind the curtain. And I do know that some of it is BS, and I made a conscious choice about a year ago and it ended up being perfect timing because I'm so glad I stopped listening to some of those voices before this moment happened. But I made a conscious choice, as a middle-aged white woman, I decided I don't have time or space to entertain voices that haven't fought the same or harder fights that I'm fighting every day. Which means I no longer listen to mediocre middle-aged white men. You don't have anything to teach me. And so, when I look around those men who would, on paper, fulfill that qualification the defining characteristic is they are not average. They are above average. I am looking for above average voices. I am looking for extraordinary voices. I have been on this journey of making very conscious decisions about the diversity of information that I take in.

When I noticed that the algorithms are feeding me too many white female voices. I make conscious changes to go seek out alternative points of view so that I can reach all of those people with whatever message needs to get out there. We're in this extraordinary pivot time and I've had the fortune and the luxury to collect some skills that serve me very well in a digital work from home capacity. And I know a lot of people haven't. And if I want to get those skills to them, I need to make sure it's coming from a place that's going to appeal to a broad range of voices and not just voices that look and sound like my own. And so, for me, the decision of who I listen to is counterbalanced by who I'm trying to reach. Because if they're who I'm trying to reach, then I need to listen to them as well.

Chris Delaney: Love that there's so much to dive into. And we're going to wrap up here for a second, but man, I can't wait to sit down with each one of you one-to-one and dive more into about you, your journeys and right off the rip, listening to this right away, the question was, who do you listen to? This gave you a good insight into what to listen to. We heard in here, listen to people who have what you want and have been, where you've been and take that a step further. Be really discerning in who you listen to and be very specific about that and be more intentional about what you're trying to learn. Stay away from the algorithms because the algorithms are going to feed you what is congruent with what you like.

And so, in order for you to understand who to listen to you, sometimes you need to be challenged. As Victor said earlier, which I love as well, I love people who can challenge me, and we can have that discussion and the level of intensity that folks bring to this table. And Danielle talked about a willingness to change momentum to pivot and to put the time in and Jinx obviously discussing about how do we bring more people to the table who are the right fit?

How do we bring people into this culture of intensity, where we actually get shit done and do things? And Kathleen smoothing that out with the idea of let's teach people also how to handle the emotions, right? How do we handle the ebbs and flows of what's going on? And I will continue to operate with this inner circle of people because I really trust, love and respect to every single person here. And these are the people I listened to. So, for you listening right now, what do you do about this? Because we talked about who do you listen to you, but now it's time. What do you do about this? Start taking a look at who's in your corner. And if you don't find people in your corner who are championing your journey and see it with you, and it's time to go find a new fucking group of people, because ultimately you'll never outgrow the people next to you. You should always be seeking people who are challenging to rise higher, to grow bigger, challenging your ideas, and also seeing what's best for you while also making sure it's about you and your journey. And they're not trying to take it away from you and find people who are fucking great at something that you are not. I learned a long time ago that A players look for A pluses. They don't look for B's and C's. So, don't be fearful. Look for people who give abundantly and give from a place of compassion. And from a place of heart. Business is more about collaboration than it is about competition, this new world, my friends, and until next time, see you next Tuesday.

Chris 'Jinx' Jenkins: What the fuck are you waiting for?

Chris Delaney: Take what you learned in this episode and do something with it.

Chris 'Jinx' Jenkins: You'll find all the links and resources we talked about in our show notes for this episode.

Chris Delaney: Go to unfuckmybusiness.com to subscribe to the show.

About the Podcast

Show artwork for Unf*ck My Business
Unf*ck My Business
No bullshit advice for business owners who want to be resilient as fuck.

About your hosts

Profile picture for Robyn Sayles

Robyn Sayles

HOST | SHOW RUNNER
Twitter + IG: @robynsayles
Profile picture for Kaplan Akincilar

Kaplan Akincilar

EDITOR | PRODUCER
IG: @kaplanakincilar
Profile picture for Chris 'Jinx' Jenkins

Chris 'Jinx' Jenkins

HOST
Twitter: @immrdubious
Profile picture for Chris Delaney

Chris Delaney

HOST
IG: @iamchrisdelaney
Profile picture for Danielle Laura

Danielle Laura

HOST
IG: @_daniellelaura_
Profile picture for Jenn Bolivar

Jenn Bolivar

HOST
Profile picture for Victor Bolivar

Victor Bolivar

HOST
IG: @victorbolivar_33
Profile picture for Kathleen Seide

Kathleen Seide

HOST
IG: @geekmermaid